woopiiii i just got a "new" boat - rigging questions-

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panduro
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woopiiii i just got a "new" boat - rigging questions-

Post by panduro » Mon Mar 10, 2014 6:56 pm

Hey all,

spring is coming and i just got my new boat in good condition to replace my old one design 14, life is good :)
new boat is a used boat from 2007, its been stored in a warm garage since late 9 with little use… its a polish design with a cst rig.
I will probably need some assistance, so i hope you guys will take a bit of time and try to explain things to me in a simple fashion :)

all parts is suppose to be there but I'm not really sure it is….

I'm rigging it for the first time, only seen 1 picture of it rigged, so I'm trying to figure it out(very advanced compared to my old OD).
At this time i got 2 questions(with more to come).

1/ forestay seems to be missing, how is your forestays rigged and what material and thickness, wire, dyneema, does it have a purchase like the shrouds adjustment?

2/ vang/gnav. its got a gnav system, but its lagging a purchase. how much purchase should i rig it with?

best regards

panduro
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gnav.jpg
Last edited by panduro on Sat Mar 15, 2014 1:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Hendo
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Re: woopiiii i just got a "new" boat - rigging questions

Post by Hendo » Tue Mar 11, 2014 6:48 am

Killer boat! your stepping out of the eighties ! The Colored line on the front of the the mast is the forestay. It is made of Vectran that goes to a 2:1,
and then turning forward. From there a lanyard from the bow would then go through another hi-load block and back to make a 4:1 . at this point you attach your control line of say 4:1 colored line that slips in the cleat and you have a 16:1 forstay.

Hendo.

Hendo
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Re: woopiiii i just got a "new" boat - rigging questions

Post by Hendo » Tue Mar 11, 2014 6:54 am

At Henderson Boat Co. we rig our vang/ Gnav 24:1 purchase, you do the math.

panduro
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Re: woopiiii i just got a "new" boat - rigging questions

Post by panduro » Tue Mar 11, 2014 7:23 pm

Hi hendo,
first, thanks for your answers, i actually liked the eighties :).

it was rigged as a jib haleyard, not as a forestay. now its a forestay again.
thanks, that should make a easyer load for my mate :).



best regards

panduro

panduro
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Re: woopiiii i just got a "new" boat - rigging questions

Post by panduro » Sat Mar 15, 2014 1:39 pm

2014-03-14 16.42.31.jpg
a picture or two to accompagny my question :)

and now for a small question …

same height as the gnav ends on the mast, there is hole/anker plate for a t-terminal for a lower shroud, although i don't have any shroud to put there or a tensioning system for that matter.
do your boats have shrouds that ends so low?

best regards

panduro
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2014-03-14 16.42.59.jpg

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Shu
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Re: woopiiii i just got a "new" boat - rigging questions-

Post by Shu » Mon Mar 17, 2014 8:35 pm

That is the typical location for lower shrouds. DO NOT sail the boat without them or you will be repairing your mast.
Steve Shumaker
USA 1183

panduro
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Re: woopiiii i just got a "new" boat - rigging questions-

Post by panduro » Tue Mar 18, 2014 5:59 pm

Hi Steve, and thank you for that answer, seems like very valuable infer to me ;).

any roughf guestimate on what kind of tension i need on those lower shrouds?

i know that that would properly be easier to answer if i knew what mast i got… i have mailed the old owner and hope he knows what model cst it is.

best regards

pandruo

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Shu
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Re: woopiiii i just got a "new" boat - rigging questions-

Post by Shu » Tue Mar 18, 2014 8:12 pm

A good starting place for lower shroud tension:
With the mast up and the rig fully tensioned but cap shrouds eased:
1. Without the main, the mast below the lower spreaders should be slightly inverted.
2. With the main up, but no vang (gnav), the mast below the lower spreaders should be approximately straight.
3. With the Vang on there should be a little bend in the mast below the lower spreaders, but most of the bend should be above the top spreaders.
There are variations on this depending on rake, mast, sails, etc., but this is a good starting point for a middle-aged CST.
Steve Shumaker
USA 1183

Eike
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Re: woopiiii i just got a "new" boat - rigging questions-

Post by Eike » Wed Mar 19, 2014 9:15 pm

Hi there,

I know the boat a bit. One of Polish design. Mast is a CST HM1. Gnav and lower stay adjustment have been described well. Mast in bottom half should be straight to slightly bending forward. Adjust lowers and pull rigg tension. Then have a look what the mast does. You can see it better when you step back a few meters. Spectra forestays are alright, although I trust a 3,5mm dyform wire more. Failure in forstay aswell as having lower stays to loose or too tight can easily end up in making 2 mast out of one.

Go for a 26-28 tension on the forstay(use Loose Tension Gauge, everybody worldwide uses it) and about 34-36 on the mainstays. Set it up that rake is about 8,08m (+/-2cm) from bottom edge top mark on mast down to the bottom edge of transom. Measure when ur setup tensions on forstay and mainstays are on, everything else is to be loose. If rake is much bigger ease forstay and pull more mainstays. Opposite case, opposite trimming!

Where is the boat located now? If in Europe i would strongly recomend doing the German Nationals and the Europeans. They will be held within 10 day, one following the other and just 25km apart! There we can have a close look at all your set up and get your trim right. Besides that I know that there have been some structural issues on the hull, dont know if they have been overdone. So you may have an eye on the areas around the shrout fittings, the rack attachment to the hull and the bottom box side on which the ruder stock is attached to. Dont want to scare you, its a realy nice build boat, just dont want you to get lost out sailing when something serious could happen. Probably issues have been worked over.

If further question occur, feel free to ask. Hende gave you some good advice and he knows what hes talking about. Here in Europe I'm always open to help you, becoming a boatbuilder as well, mainly working on the German I14 fleet and been sailing these boats for nearly a decade now.

Cheers!
Eike
GER 37 (B3 Z)
Erholung pur 1.1

panduro
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Re: woopiiii i just got a "new" boat - rigging questions-

Post by panduro » Sun Mar 23, 2014 9:16 am

THANK you she and Eike,

this info helps a lot!

bbc

panduro
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Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 6:14 pm
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to low forestay tension, what can i do?

Post by panduro » Sun Apr 13, 2014 1:04 pm

a rigger made a new 3mm wire forstay and 3mm wire lowers for me. lower shrouds, main shrouds, cap shrouds, forestay are all rigged with a purchase so i can work on getting everything right, in the future i would love to change to turnbuckles for simplicity though…

tried setting the rake around 808 as suggested, then pulling on main shrouds on till they were around 35 on loos gauge, that resulted in a rake around 810 and 17 on the for stay.
tried setting the rake to 800 same procedure, got 18 on the for stay.
tried 790 rake with 12 on the mains, then pulling forestay on till the rake was around 808 that resulted in 20 on the forestay and 36 on the mainstay.
If i continue to pull on forestay my mains go quickly to 40, with around 21 on forestay. don't dare to continue...

It seem to me like my geometry is of, my mains gain tension much faster than my forestay.

what could i be doing wrong in my metode of setting up tension ? is there a way to change the ratios which the forestay and mains gain tension?
move the mast a bit forwards,backwards, gearing in purchase?

ps I'm mathematically challenged and fresh out of bright ideers :(

Im open to all suggestions and will appreciate answers very much.

best regards

panduro

panduro
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Boat Number: N001

Re: woopiiii i just got a "new" boat - rigging questions-

Post by panduro » Sun May 18, 2014 1:27 pm

so it would seem that I'm right about my righs geometry, was able to move the mast 4 cm/1,5" forward in the mast foot, which did give me more for stay tension.
will move mast foot a bit forward when winter comes, but until then i will try to get water time instead.

mainstay 36 now gets me 24 on for stay, i know its not ideal, but its a lot better than before and it have to do for now.

best regards

panduro

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