OD penny, need a "bit" of help

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panduro
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OD penny, need a "bit" of help

Post by panduro » Mon May 27, 2013 5:07 pm

Hi all,

First post, has done a bit of lurking and you all seem like cool people.

I am the captain of this ship, and i have my wifes permission to say so ;)
A bit about me self, 33 years old, started as a small kid sailing small kellboats, its been hmm about 15 years since ive been in a dinghy which was an singlehanded europa, sailed 5 years in that. since ive only been deck creew on keelboats when friends needed an extra crewmember at smaller races, maybe once a year.

My friend who will join me IN the water has only sailed a couple of times on large keelboats.

so we got our work cut out for us thats for sure... but we are both in good psycical condition and can swimm...


Just purchased a "well" used old one design i14 built at ontario yachts. seller meant it was from 1995. it has an enscription on the hull - ZTY141338B989. and sailnumber N1.
i14.jpg
hull is in good condition exept for a crack in the connection between hull and deck.
happened because the boat had water in it and the water expanded when turning to ice during the winter.
hopefully it will be an easy fix. ill ask questions when im done with my daggerboard ;)...

superspar gran prix rigging with 2 traps. all fittings is there and working.
main good condition, jib and spinaker in good working condition.

but the daggerboard is pretty beat up because the last owner sailed from a beach and wasnt carefull. It was and was missing large pieces of fibreglass a couple of places and had a bit of bad wood.
sanded it all down to solid wood, but that has left the board with some spots with cavaties because i had to grind it a 3mm down a couple of places to get to solid wood. the tip is also severely damaged and the old owner made a rep. at some point.
(pictures attached).
14-daggerboard-1.jpg
14-daggerboard-2.jpg
14-daggerboard-3.jpg
14-daggerboard-4.jpg


is it important that i recreate the original shape and size when repairing?
The tip is pretty fucked up and it would be way easyer just to cut a curve in the bottom 15cm instead of trying to build the original shape with filler...?
the Back end of the board is also pretty damaged and thin, Does it matter much if i cut the last 1cm of to get a strait edge?
What filler should i use for filling the cavaties?
what type of fiberglass, what weight and how many layers is best to use for daggerboards?

I will appriciate any advice deeply...

Best regards

Bent from Denmark

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oliver1000
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Re: OD penny, need a "bit" of help

Post by oliver1000 » Tue May 28, 2013 9:40 am

Hi There,

First of all, it looks a bit older than 1995 (although I'm not sure what was happening in the states around that time). What is the beam length on her? The reason I say is that it looks remarkably like you have an alloy spinnaker pole and possibly might find that you need a bobstay to stiffen it. My boat from 1990 used to be fitted with one but the carbon pole has made it obsolete.

With regards to the daggerboard - as a development class technically you do not need to recreate the original shape. However, the boat will be designed to sail with that so I'd get as close as possible to it else you may need to make further modifications - probably 1cm of the trailing edge shouldn't make too much of a difference as long as it is still held soundly in it's slot.
When I repaired the trailing edge on my daggerboard I just used epoxy wood filler to repair the core and then coated over it in a layer of 300gsm biaxial cloth. Ovington's were using biaxial to manufacture the hulls in the late 80's early 90's. However, the daggerboard had originally been made using fairly fine carbon cloth, and I guess I could have used 100gsm glass but didn't have enough of it at the time.

Kris or Shu may be able to expand on what I have said with more knowledge and experience at building/repairing boats - the "new B6" thread, or shu's "my new boat" thread may be of help, as well as the "upgrade of US1112" thread in the meantime

Ollie
Ollie Williams
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panduro
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Re: OD penny, need a "bit" of help

Post by panduro » Tue May 28, 2013 1:22 pm

Hi Ollie,

First, thanks for answering my post :)

okay, hopefully somebody else can tell me more about the proble build year.

english nautical expressions are not my strong side.. beam lengh= width or width at the waterline? sorry for the stupid question.

Yes it has an aluminium pole. how far should that bobstay extend?

thanks for the advice on fiberglass and will read those threads :).

B

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Re: OD penny, need a "bit" of help

Post by hawkeye » Tue May 28, 2013 2:35 pm

Hello Bent,

I'm quite sure it's from -89 according to the two last digits in the hull number.

I've got one from -91 that I'm slowly restoring.

/Håkan from Gothenburg Sweden

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rand
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Re: OD penny, need a "bit" of help

Post by rand » Tue May 28, 2013 3:30 pm

OK, that is a Cross III design circa 1985? (probably built 1989 from the vin number) it was adopted as the One Design 14 (not to be confused with the One Design 14 from about 50 years ago) and was sold in a few different configurations. The grand prix rig was the closest to the International 14.

The boat will be 5'6" wide.

The bow does look like it has the remains of a bobstay still attached, and yes you will want to rig that, or you will be buying a new bowsprit (when you do, carbon is nice, no bobstay needed…).

For the hull deck crack, clean it out, fill it with epoxy and filler (Shu will tell you exactly what to use!) squeeze out as much as you can. This separation is not uncommon...

For the board, I think the only important thing is that it fit into your trunk when you are done. Modern boards are much narrower (and longer), retrofitting a modern board into an old trunk is fairly straightforward, but I would not worry about that. Epoxy and carbon fibre will give you a strong stiff board and give you many hours of enjoyable sailing!

Welcome to the fleet! Do let us know when you are ready to host a worlds in Denmark, it has been too long! :-)
Rand Arnold
International 14 USA 1143
"A Bumblebee Called Kate"
(former US President, former US Measurer)

panduro
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Re: OD penny, need a "bit" of help

Post by panduro » Tue May 28, 2013 5:10 pm

Thanks for answering :)

Yes it is 5'6" wide.

Looking foreward to Shu's input then :).

Dont Want to buy new bowsprit, would like to keep this boat on the cheap side... the remains of a bobstay would be? anybody got pictures or a "plan" for a fitting bobstay?

I was hoping to go with fiberglass as carbonfibre isnt very cheap...

Håkan: which sailnumber has your boat got? restoration thread? any pictures of your project.

lol host a worlds in denmark, i have actually never seen a int14/od in denmark... Any danish sailers on this forum?
but ill hopefully be on/IN the water a couple off weeks from now.

B

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Shu
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Re: OD penny, need a "bit" of help

Post by Shu » Tue May 28, 2013 6:50 pm

Hmmm... I lost my post. I'll try again.
As Rand said, trimming some of the daggerboard won't hurt much, unless it results in the daggerboard not fitting snuggly in the case. If the daggerboard fit is sloppy and it angles aft while sailing, it will increase your lee helm. A lot of lee helm while sailing with the spinnaker up is not good. This will become apparent once you are confident enough to helm the boat downwind from the trapeze.

To repair the daggerboard use an epoxy based fairing compound, or better yet, colloidal silica thickened epoxy. Make certain the broken surfaces are clean, and wet the exposed wood with liquid epoxy before applying the epoxy paste. You can add some microballoons to the epoxy paste (add the balloons first, then thicken it with the colloidal silica) to make it sand easier, but don't add much, because it weakens the epoxy.

As for the hull joint, clean up any broken or otherwise nasty material, and wet the mating surfaces with liquid epoxy. Apply the thickened epoxy (no microballoons), and hold the joint together with clamps. You don't have to squeeze the joint very hard, just hold it together until it cures. If you've applied enough epoxy paste, some will squeeze out of the joint. Clean and sand off the excess, paint it, and it should be ready to sail.

Welcome to the wonderful, fast, and wet world of I-14s. Swimming is part of it. Always come back in while you still have enough strength to right the boat a few more times, and you should be fine.
Steve Shumaker
USA 1183

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oliver1000
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Re: OD penny, need a "bit" of help

Post by oliver1000 » Tue May 28, 2013 10:50 pm

My boat still has some of the remains of her bobstay. I apologise for the photo quality (and colour scheme!)- this was taken a while ago on a dodgy mobile phone.

There is a lacing eye on the base of her bow - it is actually bolted/screwed (can't remember which) into the hull and epoxied in which is why I haven't removed it as the tack line used to quite like wrapping itself around it. A problem solved with yet more elastic
There was a small block attached to the outboard end of the pole (but inside the pole). That is the piece of rope in the photo - the block was inside the pole tied through - and therefore to - the end plate
There is a small bullet eye in the pole to allow the line through
I imagine the line would have run down the pole and been secured to a strong point in the cockpit with an elastic take up system

Don't let the colour fool you the pole is carbon (would have been an early one) but I never quite worked out why the fittings were on the pole the previous owner had it like that and the block didn't appear to have been used for some time (I hoping not to find out any time soon!)

Hope this helps

Ollie
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panduro
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Re: OD penny, need a "bit" of help

Post by panduro » Wed May 29, 2013 9:52 pm

Hi again,

you all seem very nice and helpfull.

daggerboard: sounds good, ill just trim it a bit diagonal so i dont lose so much "width" of the board.
accidental jibing while being on the trap doesnt sound good...
Thank you for the advice on filler etc, ill look into what i can get here(lol what i can translate to danish).

thanks you, im sure we will enjoy it.

Bobstay, thank you for the picture and explenation, ill look into it in the weekend and post a Drawing of the hookup, hope you'll all correct me if wrong (to avoid expensive mistakes).

I like the color scheme, a fun boat should also be cool looking, the yatching world is to serious...

Bent

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Shu
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Re: OD penny, need a "bit" of help

Post by Shu » Thu May 30, 2013 12:48 am

It's not the accidental gybe, it's what happens long before that has a chance to occur, when the tiller is pushing you away from the boat. :shock:
Steve Shumaker
USA 1183

panduro
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Re: OD penny, need a "bit" of help

Post by panduro » Fri May 31, 2013 5:50 am

that also sounds like something to avoid. what have i gotten myself into :)

B

panduro
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Re: OD penny, need a "bit" of help

Post by panduro » Sun Jun 02, 2013 5:27 pm

So back to bob, well bobstay.

the bobstay was already rigged.
Bobstay extended pole.jpg
bobstay pole retracted.jpg
all i need to do is to make the rope retract so it isnt dragged thought the water when the spinaker isnt in use. how do i rig that?

my sheets and halyards for the spinaker is missing, would anybody know what lenght and thickness i need for a standard layout od gt?

best regards

bent

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Re: OD penny, need a "bit" of help

Post by Hendo » Mon Jun 03, 2013 5:07 am

Bent,
Spinnakers sheets are 35' ft. long do the translation. after you sail and you think there too long, shorten them a foot or two.7mm thick
With the spinnaker halyard ours is almost 70' ft. 4mm.on a modern boat. The bob needs to have a bungee tied to it that is inside the tube.

panduro
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Re: OD penny, need a "bit" of help

Post by panduro » Mon Jun 03, 2013 3:14 pm

Thank you, that helps alot.

bent

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Re: OD penny, need a "bit" of help

Post by Norwegian I14 Team » Sun Jun 16, 2013 7:22 pm

Hi,
I've just bought an One Design 14 from 1992 built by Ontario Yachts which has been neglected for some years.

I have all essential parts (hull, mast, boom, tiller, rudder and sails) but quite many parts has been nicked.

Thus, to rig the boat correctly is a challenge.

From the pictures on this string, my boat looks very similar.

Could someone please send me close up photos that describes the rigging?

thor

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